March 26, 2017

February 28, 2013

The Director of Reconciliation Illustrates the Mechanics of Collusion

An interview with Canon David Porter, ++Justin Welby’s new Director of Reconciliation for the Anglican Communion transcribed by one of the elves over at T19:

ES: But so I am clear returning to my question, the press release from Lambeth Palace says ‘his [that is your] focus will be on supporting creative ways of renewing conversations in relationships around deeply held differences within the Church of England and the Anglican Communion’

Porter: Well I think we recognise that if the church is going to make any constructive contribution to the conflicts that are going on in our world then we need to look to ourselves and we need to be a people who are on a journey of Reconciliation who are modelling, not necessarily that we agree because it doesn’t necessarily mean that we are all going to agree, but that we hold our differences in a very Christian and constructive way

ES: Well, doesn’t this put a huge burden on your shoulders because the truth is that these tensions within the Anglican Communion and the Church of England have as you have just reflected in a way, have arisen because of very deeply held theological doctrinal disputes about questions like women bishops, like homosexuality, and it is difficult to see how one man by focussing on ‘process’ can overcome those.

Porter: Well in one sense it isn’t my job to overcome those issues – there are plenty of more intelligent more creative people who have lived and journeyed with these issues for quite a number of years. My job is actually to look at ‘process’ – it is to look at how we create the space for conversations to take place where people will still differ and they still will disagree but they will do so in a way that is able to say ‘look this is how Christians disagree, this is how we hold tensions and differences together’

ES: Except that on some of these issues people will believe that the disagreements go to the very heart of what it means to be a Christian

Porter: that is true

ES: so how can, how can a better ‘process’ overcome that?

Porter: well, in my background in Northern Ireland I used to say to people that if you are a fundamentalist protestant who believes that the catholic church are not Christian or if you are a strong catholic who believes there is no salvation outside the church and you’re in that conversation, the reality is that Jesus still tells you to love the people that you perceive as your enemies and that shows that you are holding what you hold on to in a Christian way and are able to disagree within that commitment of Jesus teling us how we disagree

ES: Do you think that some senior members of the Anglican Communion have forgotten that basic fact in the way that they have conducted themselves in these debates?

Porter: I think all of us when we get caught up in conflicts that are deep to who we are and to the values that we hold on to – we do forget that bigger voice from God that calls us to a different way of engaging with difference…read the rest

You can listen to the entire interview here.

Can there be any doubt at all about Archbishop Welby’s intentions? Can there be any doubt about what he means by “reconciliation”?

He means that even though those who promote non-celibate homosexual behavior in the church and those who uphold biblical sexual morality make mutually exclusive truth claims about the nature and content of the Christian faith, the Person of Christ, and the authority and truthfulness of the Word of God, they can and should call one another “brother”, work together to proclaim “the gospel”, and actively legitimize and promote one another’s ministry.

As I’ve said before, many times, to agree with him and participate in any such process of mutual ministry or legitimization or even to call one of these heretics “brother” is a betrayal of the gospel. It is to participate with the hellish work of leading souls away from Christ. St. Paul in 1 Cor 6:9-10 writes that those who live lives characterized by homosexuality (not referring to the repentant person who struggles and falls but who struggles against it) will not inherit the kingdom of heaven. The message received by people who struggle with homosexuality when they see false teachers like Bishop Johnston embraced by orthodox leaders is: “This an area over which good faithful Christians can differ. If I side with Johnston on this, I can still faithfully serve Jesus and consider myself a disciple.”

That is a lie that St. Paul says damns people.

Bishop Johnston is teaching soul destroying heresy.

To participate with Canon Porter and Archbishop Welby and reconcile with men like Bishop Johnston without first demanding repentance and recantation, is to favor the visible fellowship of clergy over the care and protection of souls…a form of prejudice made even more sickening when it is given the false name “unity” and described as “reconciliation” .

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The point being missed by Porter (and formerly missed by +Williams) is that the Protestants and Catholics of Northern Ireland are NOT in the same Church.  In essence, a matter of bringing both religious points of view to respect the rule of law, and reject vengeance- which are part of the doctrine of both denominations.  That revisionists and orthodox Christians can both contribute to digging wells in Sudan is NOT what is in dispute.  What is in dispute is the very definition of Christianity within the Anglican Communion.  What is being suggested in these “dialogues” is that whenever 51% of this or that national synod or convention decides to overthrow 2000 year old doctrines, that is not only OK, but to be commended, and that everyone has to live with that in order to be considered Anglican Christians.

The actual parallel to the Northern Ireland situation, if you think about it, would be that in an Anglican Church, you need to provide enough space so that no one is excommunicated because they are members of this or that political party. You can make a case that this applies in, for example, Zimbabwe- where Porter might be able to do a lot of good.

[1] Posted by tjmcmahon on 2-28-2013 at 08:58 AM · [top]

Is the Pope Catholic?

Is the CoE ABoC a heresy endorsing, pro-gay, Government puppet?

If you say, “I’m not sure, he could be all right, let’s give him time and see” then you really have trouble pattern matching.

[2] Posted by jedinovice on 2-28-2013 at 09:25 AM · [top]

I suppose it could be somewhat like ecumenical matters since there are really different churches in conflict. Of course if you participated with a competitor you would renounce you ordination but with sufficient dialogue, this would cease to be a problem.

[3] Posted by Pb on 2-28-2013 at 09:43 AM · [top]

“ love the people that you perceive as your enemies and that shows that you are holding what you hold on to in a Christian way and are able to disagree within that commitment of Jesus teling us how we disagree…”

This is nothing more than a straw man argument when applied to the divisions of the Anglican Communion. 

Certainly one can treat non-Christians with love - but that does not equate to “hold(ing) tensions and differences together” in a single church between those teaching heresy and those teaching Christianity.

Now if instead he were to characterize the innovators as enemies of the Gospel to be removed from the church without repentance, then we might begin to get somewhere with his argument…

[4] Posted by tired on 2-28-2013 at 10:09 AM · [top]

“Go ye into all the world and develop a process after accomodating whatever I said to your myopic, chronological snobbery, teaching all modernistic fantasy to tickle their ears, and, lo, your myopic, chronological snobbery conception of Me shall be with you always.”


[5] Posted by dwstroudmd+ on 2-28-2013 at 10:34 AM · [top]

Here’s what you need to accomodate to ... ... in case Porter missed the TEc memo or the past 40 years in TEc.

[6] Posted by dwstroudmd+ on 2-28-2013 at 10:41 AM · [top]

Move over “listening process” and make way for the “reconciliation process.” Exactly as many S.F. commenters have predicted.

[7] Posted by Undergroundpewster on 2-28-2013 at 11:16 AM · [top]

“Bonds of affection” require voluntary discipline, sacrifice, restraint and observance of covenant.  You know, like a marriage.

The whole AC approach to the TEC mess has enabled undisciplined, self-centered, self-serving sorts.

You know, like adulterers.

[8] Posted by Timothy Fountain on 2-28-2013 at 11:38 AM · [top]

It is becoming more difficult to be a Christian and an Episcopalian at the same time because with each victory the Episcopal Church accomplishes with causes they promote like homosexual clergy, and pro-abortion activists, we are called upon by the leaders of the Episcopal Church to disrespect Scripture and regard it as inferior to their reasoning.
As a Christian, it would be easier to reconcile if we did not have to fear that young people, who rely on the fallible reasoning of these leaders, might not learn the truth of the Gospel and have it to guide them away from the real health and spiritual consequences of living the life endorsed by their church leaders.

[9] Posted by Betty See on 2-28-2013 at 09:31 PM · [top]

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